AMAZON MUSIC'S TIM HINSHAW: "HIP-HOP GOT ME IN TROUBLE (BUT IT ALSO SAVED MY LIFE)"

It’s fair to say that Amazon Music Head of Hip-Hop and R&B Tim Hinshaw is not merely respected and admired in the music world and the culture at large but beloved. Indeed, the story of how he assembled video testimonials from top artists singing his praises—as someone with a profound understanding of the music and culture, yes, but also as a human being—to land his initial gig at the tech giant is now legendary. We asked the Compton, Calif., native about developing a voice for Amazon, how he first fell in love with hip-hop and his thoughts about the 50th anniversary—as well as Amazon Music’s campaign to celebrate the moment, “50 & Forever.”

Let’s start by talking about the scope of your job.

I started in 2018. I was basically brought over to build out Amazon Music’s hip-hop and R&B strategy. And that evolved into me working with other realms within the Amazon family, such as Prime Video, to help usher in a culture from a Black music and culture standpoint, and being able to work on projects that I think are meaningful to the growth of Amazon Music.

So when I started, [Senior Music Curator, Hip-Hop, R&B and Afrobeats] Rochelle Balogun was here, as well as a woman named Sharon Bako, who’s at Def Jam now. We were just laser-focused on building an authentic point of view for Amazon Music. Because it’s a tech company—not a name you would usually bring up in the midst of a hip-hop or R&B conversation—we said, “We know this consumer. We know the people who are moving this culture. How do we authentically talk to these consumers from Amazon?” That took a long time—to develop a voice, a look and feel, how we showed up in the marketplace. The things that we said yes to and the things that we said no to, which are equally important.

I am proud of a lot of the things that we said no to, because on the surface they were great opportunities. But building organically and authentically was most important for us. It’s why artists like Tyler, The Creator, Kendrick Lamar, J. Cole and Nicki Minaj are not afraid to stand next to Amazon now.

Let’s talk about that point of view and voice, which you had to build from the ground up. What do you think are the primary characteristics that differentiate Amazon from other companies in this space?

We don’t try too hard. I think a lot of people jump on things just because they might bring together a brand and some top-tier artists. It sounds great in your head, but to the people who actually digest this stuff, it might go over the wrong way. The hip-hop 50th anniversary is a prime example. Every brand is going to have a point of view on hip-hop’s 50th. But we want to tell authentic stories that you might not have expected from us.

Like “U.N.I.T.Y.,” the Queen Latifah record—I wanted to do a brand campaign around that song in 2018 when we had the “A Voice Is All You Need” campaign. Just hearing those horns is so iconic. It didn’t work out then, but now it’s worked out perfectly for our new 50 & Forever brand spot, because this is the 50th anniversary of hip-hop and the 30th anniversary of [Latifah’s] Black Reign album. But it’s also the 50th anniversary of the sample that’s used in the “U.N.I.T.Y.” record, “Message From the Inner City” by The Crusaders. Just diving into that history and having the stars align—that’s what we actively look for, to tell a holistic story.

OK, I’m-a nerd out a little now. The original song is probably 11 or 12 minutes long. The piece that’s looped on that U.N.I.T.Y. record doesn’t show up until the 9:20 mark. That showed the dedication of the original producer, sitting there and taking his time to digest that track and figure out the part that was right. That’s how we approach Rotation opportunities: We take a fine-toothed comb, and we sit with things for a while. If it doesn’t feel right, we won’t do it. And sometimes those are tough conversations to have. We might spend money on something that doesn’t come out right, and we have to go to [Amazon Music execs] Ryan [Redington] and Steve [Boom] and have a conversation. We assess things in terms of what they might mean for the brand. I think Amazon has been great about giving me the space to fail at times.

Say a little bit about Rotation and what it represents.

I hate to say this, because it sounds corny, but it’s been about how we can build our everything store for hip-hop and R&B fans. When I was growing up, I knew when I got home from school, I could turn on BET and watch Rap City at 4:00, and 106 and Park at 6:00. That was how I heard new music and saw new videos, and how I would see my favorite rappers wearing clothes that I wanted to wear. And my point of view in 2018, when we started Rotation, was that something like that really didn’t exist.

Amazon can create that feel more than any other company in the space. So it’s about taking what Rochelle does on the playlists—building Rap Rotation and R&B Rotation, and those being the home for where you find new R&B and rap music on Amazon—and building that bridge to our merch partnership with Kendrick Lamar around his tour, hosting his livestream on Prime Video, and so on. Rotation was designed around finding different touchpoints using our resources to make hip-hop and R&B fans feel like, “OK, I can go to here to find the new Kendrick Lamar or Tyler, The Creator or Chlöe Bailey album. And then I could also see Chlöe Bailey in [the Amazon Prime series] Swarm or I could also see Tyler’s livestream and buy his merch on Amazon.” So the question was, How do we build this world? Rotation just worked out naming-wise, in that it actually articulates what we thought we wanted to be—this whole world rotating, turning with Amazon’s resources.

So you’ve got all of these elements from different aspects of the Amazon business that are tied together by a kind of channel.

Yeah, for sure. And I think the foundational touchpoint for any moves we make with Rotation is that we’ve just gotta think it’s cool. We wanted everybody we considered tastemakers to look at what we were doing and think, “That’s cool.” I think we achieved that from an artist standpoint—what we’re doing is actually tasteful and we don’t feel afraid to stand next to that. I think that’s the beauty of it. We don’t want to try hard; we want to be the place where you feel invited, but you also feel, like, man, I feel proud to be a part of something…

Something that’s overseen and informed by people who are hardcore fans, not by a corporate entity that says “We gotta get next to this hip-hop thing.”

For sure!

Say a little bit about how Rotation fits in.

Coming out of Covid, the Rotation team kicked off Amazon Music’s livestreaming point of view with Tyler, The Creator. That was our first lockstep 360 partnership. He was releasing his new music. We agreed to do a livestream in Brooklyn; this was in June 2020. We did merch that was exclusive to Rotation. It really served as a case study, though we didn’t realize it at the time. It was just about the relationship with Tyler and [managers] Chris and Kelly Clancy. It was a cool idea that we wanted to get off the ground.

And we made it happen. We did three shows in a week and livestreamed the last one. Tyler doesn’t usually stand next to brands in this way. But we did it in such a tasteful way that other artists thought it was cool. That it was coming from Tyler, one of the most creative guys in our culture today, really kicked it off for us. And then, man, it just took off like a firestorm. We had various conversations with managers and artists about how to grow the business. And here we are. I think what our livestreaming team has done has been amazing. The production element is next-level. We want to give artists that platform to be creative.

Do you have a model for a livestream performance, or is it tailored to each artist?

I don’t think it’s one size fits all. It’s definitely collaborative. A lot of the artists that I work with obviously have amazing teams with strong points of view and are right 100% of the time. But I think where we come in is: We can offer best-in-class production as far as how this looks and feels on camera and shows up on television. If you pair that with minds like Dave Free, Mike Carson and Kendrick Lamar, you get what you saw in that livestream.

We give you the tools to play with; you come with your creative ideas, and we’ll build this out together and make this some of the best work that people have ever seen. My take is always if you trust an artist and their vision, you can’t lose. You can help shape, guide and steer, but at the end of the day, nobody has to get on the stage except these artists. And they know how they want to be perceived, how they want to look on camera. You’ve got to trust that 100%.

As we look at hip-hop’s 50th, what are your big takeaways about this moment?

Oh, man. I think about so many different moments that predate me even being here and being a student of the game, a student of hip-hop. One MC I feel doesn’t get enough shine is [NYC rapper] Big L. I listened to his freestyles constantly—the way he put words together was amazing. I feel like a lot of stories aren’t being told.

I hope that the stories that are told as this year progresses are relevant to the standpoint of, “Wow, I actually never knew that about Big L,” or “I never knew that about this Queen Latifah record.” If you’re involved in this culture and creating a point of view on hip-hop’s 50th, I think the prerequisite should be that you have to do deep dives. You can’t just come with the surface-level shit. Because we owe that to hip-hop. It’s given the world so much, in terms of its influence and power. It’s uplifting. And I think that it would be a disservice for people to not shine a light on moments that don’t get proper recognition in our culture. That also goes for some of the people behind the scenes, the Chris Lightys, the Shakir Stewarts—people who had so much influence on where we are as a culture. I hope that they get the love and shine that they deserve this year.

I’d love to hear a little bit about your story and, specifically, your earliest encounters with hip-hop music and culture.

My dad spent most of my life in prison. And the times that he was out, we would go for road trips, and I’d hear certain music. I’m 32, and I remember being six years old, driving across the country in my dad’s Q45 Infiniti, and 2Pac’s “Hit ’Em Up” had just come out. My dad played that song, I bullshit you not, for six hours. He’s a West Coast guy. To see his reaction and hear these words and hear the passion that ’Pac had… I definitely shouldn’t have been listening to that song at that age. But to see my dad’s love for hip-hop and 2Pac and what was being said was amazing.

I think the second part of that is probably either the same year or the next year. My mom was driving and it was Halloween night and so many radio stations were playing “Mind Playing Tricks on Me” by Geto Boys. My mom knew those words verbatim. So when it goes, “Me and Geto Boys are Trick or Treatin’,” seeing my mom rap those lyrics, it just struck a chord. I’ve loved hip-hop ever since. Hip-hop saved my life, but it also got me in trouble. I was a kid writing raps in class instead of doing my work, or listening to music on my headphones.

But I was always a student of the art. I would listen to JAY-Z and write his lyrics down, read them and dissect them. And I just developed a love for it. I remember certain feelings when I heard new songs, new flows, new beefs. Hearing Beanie Sigel hop on Sheek Louch’s “Kiss Your Ass Goodbye” remix—that was a big thing for hip-hop, because The LOX and State Property had beef. Those moments, those conversations, have always struck a chord with me. So I’m thankful to my mom and my dad for all those moments.

Do you recall the first time that you saw the music live?

The first live show was when there was a [gang] peace treaty, I think in 1995 or ’96. There were so many rappers. I remember being with my mom and seeing that show; I was really young and it hit me—Yo, this is crazy, how rappers commanded the crowd. But my first real show was 2010, when JAY-Z was the headliner of Coachella. And at the time my brother [artist Prince Charlez] was being managed by Randy Phillips, who was the CEO of AEG Live at the time. My first time seeing JAY-Z was side stage, because we had artist passes. I’m standing there with Randy Phillips; in front of me are Beyoncé and Russell Simmons. So it’s my first time ever seeing Jay-Z, who I thought was the God of rap. That experience took my love of hip-hop to another level. Here’s this man who’s commanding this sea of people, maybe 100,000 people, out there. “Big Pimpin’” comes on and everybody’s jumping, singing it word for word. I had never seen anything like that in my life. I thought, “Wow, this hip-hop is really, really real.”

When I say hip-hop saved my life, that’s a true statement in so many different ways. Being able to feed my family from hip-hop. Hip-hop kept me off the streets in a real way. Going to the studio with my brother kept me out of harm’s way. And so I’m forever indebted to hip-hop. That’s why I’m so passionate about it in these meetings. Sometimes I get my wrist slapped, because I go really hard about what I believe in. Because it’s something that means a lot to me and changed my life.